Spyderco & security checks at airports.

[braveheart]

Hi everyone, this is Braveheart, an alias for a 20 years running gun and blade journalist, writing for some of the most prominent magazines in Europe, based in Italy. I am researching for Security Checks at airports statistics connected with folding knives carried on the body (not in cases). I have a very long experience on this, especially with Spyderco products, in different areas of the world. A metallurgy and blade size-shape feature is in the works, with connection to metal detectors of various type. Any comment and personal experience will be welcomed. Please state type of blade (steel) model and instance. Keep on rocking - Braveheart.

[scolby]

Hi Braveheart, I never carry concealed, I always put a mid-size folder (up to 3 inch blade) on my key ring and pass it across the metal detector in the key tray. I have gotten thru every time, even with a half-serrated blade (US airports only).

Typical Spyderco carry in the past has been a Walker Lightweight (FRN Handle, plain edge blade).

Also carry a Stainless Steel handle Dragonfly in the same manner.



"Chance favors the prepared mind" - Louis Pasteur

[JNewell]

My experience is all over the ballpark. There does not appear to be any standard machinery or calibration, nor any standard interpretation by security personnel, at US airports (or secured US federal/state buildings, for that matter). There are trends that you're probably well aware of, though.

Swiss army knives and Leatherman-types almost always go through carry-on bags, or around the metal detector in the change basket, unchallenged, regardless of size and blade type.

Knives that look like money clips sometimes, but not always, go through the change basket unchallenged.

If they do get challenged, I have had good luck with Delica and equivalent sized knives (specifically, a Benchmade 705 Axis), even if half-serrated (another Delica). The staff almost always have to think about the half-serrated blade; a plain edge gets no further thought once they eyeball the size.

If a non-Swiss Army or Leatherman knife is in a carry-on bag in profile view, the operator will always flag it for a visual. If it's on its edge, I have never had it inspected. (Some of these guys are good enough that they can tell you the model of the Leatherman or SAK that's in your bag -- I've had that happen.)

In theory, you could take your 5" folder with the fully serrated blade with evil black teflon coating on board in your carry-on bag if you pack it correctly (and are lucky), but I haven't bothered trying. A 4" or less plain blade seems to pass _any_ inspection at US airports, and seems to be able to get by without inspection a fair percentage of the time, so that's what I usually take. Since that's adequate for most urban and suburban tasks, I don't feel too inconvenienced by this.

There are some metal detectors that still seem to be set so that a Delica doesn't set them off, but they are fewer and farther between.

Someone once suggested carrying a self-addressed, prepaid FedEx mailer to facilitate getting rid of a knife at the airport without losing too much time (or the knife). Since the Delica seems to pass every review, I don't bother any more.

Good luck with the project.

[DAMSHARP]

I flew out of Baltimore last march,enroute

to lax, and they flagged my large voyager

tanto serratted. I gave them a few minutes

of inspecting it, then walked over and said

"I am fully aware that you have the power

to keep this tool, I just wanted to let you

know that if that is your decision, I intend

to create more paper work than you could

possibly do in 6 months". She frowned as she

handed it back.

[sam the man..]

Hi Braveheart... Welcome to the Spyderco Forums..
I don't conceal carry at airports especially when it comes to boarding flights. I keep them Spydies in their concealex sheath inside my bumbag. Had an interesting experience at the LAX last year when the security personnel noticed my Endura during a scan. I was asked to deploy the blade which is later released because its legal carry in California *phew!* <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>
In Malaysia, I don't have much problems packing the knives because I do have to take domestic flights to cover my assignments.. <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>

Sam

have spydies will travel

[ftkinney]

i have only carried a swiss army knife and once or twice a gerber multi-tool. i've never had a hassle with either. expept once with the multi-tool i bought it before they became popuar and the sercuity gaurd was not sure and had to get a supervior, it passed. for international flights i put my SAK in my bag with keys and shaving supplies to bolster the utiltarianess if needed. i have a domestic flight comming up and i might try to bring my bob lum chinese as a key chain.

FTK

[Spin]

Hi colleague just happened to come across this forum. I am a Hong Kong-based journalist myself, not on knives but politics--knives nut nonetheless.

Airport security in Hong Kong on restricted items include all kinds of weapons, but passengers are allowed to carry blades not more than 3inches.

All switchblades are, of course, banned.

I travel quite alot and among my travel gears I always bring either my spyderco michael walker lightweight, which never had any problems even with its serration, and quite often my 3inch cold steel voyager with a tanto point and half serration.

Suprisingly the custom never raised any questions with my cold steel when I put place it on the tray before going through the metal detector.

I had quite a bit of problem with the Singaporean airport security a couple months ago when I was travelling back to Hong Kong, they had my cold steel confiscated and had it sent back to Hong Kong in a seperate flight two days later--saying it &quot;looks like an offensive weapon&quot;.

Good that I still had my backup buck 2.5inch lightening HTA in my bumpbag, which went through the x ray undetected with other items.

In general, the advice for you guys for travelling to Hong Kong is that don't carry anything longer than 3inch on your person, but anything as long as a two-handed scottish claymore could be packed in your check-in lugguages (I tried that when I was on my way home from the states). Customs staff are pretty friendly here.

[The Stare]

braveheart, spin, JNewell, DAMSHARP -- welcome all of you to the forum. Don't ever recall seeing a thread with so many new posters, nor so many &quot;foreign&quot; people involved.

This is a topic that has been frequently discussed on Blade Forums, in the General forum at least scores of times. I believe the majority of it relates to internal USA flights. I'm sure you folks from other lands have a great deal of info to offer in this area.

The general gist of the threads on Blade Forums is: Blade no longer than 3&quot;, no serrations, better to just put it out on the change tray. As you all say, anything in checked in luggage.

A couple things -- Sal Glesser, president of Spderco also moderates the Spyderco forum at Blade Forums. I think it tends to average a few more posts per day, though this one is picking up.

Several custom, and a couple manufacturers make knives from G-10, carbon fiber, and FRNs of one variety or another, for concealed carry without a magnetic imprint. These have been part of, or generated threads on the general forum at Blade Forums. I would think there might be quite useful material for you there, braveheart.

Again, welcome. Hope all of you will continue to use this forum.

Stare

[sam the man..]

Hi Spin! Welcome aboard! <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle> Thanks for the kind words Stare! Your opinions are highly valued... <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>
I had the same problems entering Singapore.. My Endura, Spyderwrench and Mouse were detained and sent to the Arms and Explosive Department. They were labelled &quot;Flick Knives&quot; and were classified as &quot;Potential Offensive Weapons&quot;. No point arguing with that because Singapore is quite paranioa with edged tools. The irony is this, you can purchase the same knives off the shelves at the Republic's retail outlet.. <img src="sad.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle> Strange ain't it? But when it comes to the crunch, do stay calm and make an effort to extend you fullest cooperation with the authority... <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>

Sam

have spydies will travel

[Joyce Laituri]

Hi B-heart!

Welcome to Spyderco's forum, it's great to see you posting here!

Personally, most of here at Spy. seem to carry smaller, plainedge blades and check the rest of our pieces in our luggage. Have you found any information regarding ceramic blades? Curious about that.....

Ciao Buddy!

[Spin]

Samo, strange that your stuff was send to the Weapons and Explosives dept. I got a friend who used to work at the singaporean army in the some kind of a special ops team, specialising in explosives and he kept telling me when I was in singapore that my cold steel i usually carry is &quot;too short&quot;.

Well, he never shown me what he carries though.

I did argue with the airport customs in the incident mentioned earlier, and they finally agreed to send my cold steel separately. Well I wouldn't want to piss the authority there off since its not worth being caned for carrying a knive isn't it? Would make headline in Hong Kong.

[scolby]

Braveheart, there is a German knife manufacturer that makes a few series of knives with ceramic blades. The scales are made of either titanium or zytel. I believe that the pivot pin is steel, but that is it. Also look to other manufacturers for titanium blades. Since no one is naming names here, I will leave it to your research skills to find them.

"Chance favors the prepared mind" - Louis Pasteur

[sam the man..]

Hi Spin!
Speaking about the Singapore AED, I had to pay $16 Singapore Dollars to expedite the Spydies. Actually, they are not listed as &quot;Scheduled Weapons&quot;, but being straight and by the book, the AED officer issued me with an &quot;Export&quot; permit so the I won't get into &quot;trouble&quot; with the Malaysian customs. Well, they won't cane you, they'll just confisticate your Spydie. Its really humiliating when the officers ridicule you by saying &quot;You call that a knife&quot; when they inspect our Spyderco Mouse...
Hmmmm, special forces? Yeah, lotsa Singaporean dudes are in the Military. They look unassuming but can be really skillful with their edged tools... <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>

Sam

have spydies will travel

[James Y]

I lived in Taiwan for many years and in that time traveled to Hong Kong and Korea on several occasions. My only knife at the time was a Victorinox Spartan SAK. Never had any problems with it getting through security. In fact, due to my lack of problems with the SAK, when I fly domestically, I tend to carry perhaps an SAK Tinker (I retired the Spartan)or maybe the Soldier. Up to now, I have never brought a locking blade in a carry-on (have had lockbacks in my check-in).

I remember reading a few years ago that on his way to Mexico, Tactical Knives' Steven Dick was in LAX and he wasn't allowed to board with his Spydie Calypso Jr. because its blade locked open. (even though it's shorter than 3&quot;. I've heard experiences that range all over the place...some have gotten on with a 4&quot; serrated blade, others have had problems boarding with a mini-SAK that was in a briefcase!!
Jim

[stu]

BH,

Welcome to the forum. Your job sounds very interesting.

I have flown about 30 times over the last 10 years. They were all within the U.S. and mostly in Texas and New Mexico. I have always carried one Spyderco on my person on these occasions.

They were the fully-serrated SS Delica, plain-edged SS Endura, and a plain-edged Rookie in G-10. The SS Endura has been examined several times, but none of the others. About one month ago I took a serrated Rescue in my carry-on, as a gift, and didn't get a second look.

The serrated Delica was last carried onboard about three years ago. I have a feeling it would get more second looks now.

Take care,

stu

[cutler34]

I have flown International from Australia to New Zealand with a Native, Ladybug and Spydercard.No problems wasn't stopped.The Native and Spydercard were in my wallet.The Ladybug on my keys.
I have flown domestic in Australia with the same profile and I know numerous others who've had no problems.
I do have one friend (a law student) who had his Spydercard found when his wallet was passed under the x-ray.Caused no end of problems which he is now facing.The confiscated it and returned it when he landed.The police then arrived at his house to charge him with carrying a weapon in a public place witout a reasonable excuse.This is ongoing at the moment.

Regards
Ricki
info@outdooredge.com.au
Spyderco Club Member

[braveheart]

Thank you all from Braveheart. The answers were interesting an in line with the kind of survey I am doing. Will get back soon with some general results and tips maybe few people know about metal detectors at airports. I'm just glad I don't fly about Australia often...Have Spydies, will rock. BH.

[braveheart]

Thank you all from Braveheart. The answers were interesting and in line with the kind of survey I am doing. Will get back soon with some general results and tips maybe few people know about metal detectors at airports. I'm just glad I don't fly about Australia often...Have Spydies, will rock. BH.

[saltybones]

dont mean to bring up a super old thread, but i cant even imagine being able to carry that stuff on planes, i mean a 3 inch blade!?!?, even before 9/11 i didnt bring more than a keychain SAK with me, granted i was only 12 at the time of 9/11, eventhough i had some 3 inblades, nothing more than the SAK came along...and note that this thread ended about a month before that day...

[VashHash]

thats creepy man. Salty why did you have to point that out. Now i'm all thiking conspiracy theory and stuff

[saltybones]

haha didnt mean to make anyone paranoid :P

[peacefuljeffrey]

What is so shocking about the idea of having 3 inch blade with you on a flight, saltybones? I used to travel with my Delica, which I would take out of my pocket, attach it to my keyring and place it at the bottom of my carry-on knapsack and never had any trouble going through airport security (pre 9/11/01).

It's not the knife that makes someone dangerous or a criminal. Maybe if people stopped voluntarily feeding into the notion that it does--especially knife-people!--it wouldn't persist.

[saltybones]

ya i know, its just that i was little when knives were allowed so i grew up more in the 9/11 era you know? but i totally agree about people feeding in to the notion that knives are bad, its so frustrating

[Jay_Ev]

Wow... reading through this thread is a real eye opener as to the freedoms we were once able to enjoy here in America. Nowadays even something as innocuous as a small toenail clippers is enough to get someone detained for questioning.

[Baconman69]

Seeing that this thread is pre 9/11 how easy or difficult would it be for someone to carry a knife on a flight now?

[whkento]

I sure as heck wouldn't try...

[JLS]

FAA regs back then allowed up to a 4" blade, but most airlines (and security screeners as proxies) only allowed 3". My favorite back at that point for flying was either a G-10 Native or a G-10 Navigator. The Lil' Temp was let through after I showed them their own rules, but I was cautioned that it "looks dangerous" by the screeners.

I would probably carry either a Lil' Temp or I might even buy a Para to supplement my regular full size Military. For some reason, 3" is perceived as much less of a threat than 4".

This is a very old thread, but it's interesting to see how times have changed. I flew to South America in December of 2000 with a Navigator clipped to me. The customs guy in Brazil even commented that he liked it.

[Brad S.]

Wierd one for me is that I carryed a 3" benchmade everyday from sixth grade all through highschool. Never had a problem.

[SmoothOne25]

i have learned the a few things through various personal experiences: it varies everywhere from time and place. but most importantly it is ALWAYS the person! you dress well, look sober, are quiet and calm and reserved you can walk on with a fs police ss bad ass and have them not bat an eyelash. you can have it attached to your belt and say "here's my knife look at now and see its nothing and go on your way. also where you go seems to be an issue, my friend who carries a black blade ce native was told that he should not have brought that and that he should take it out of pockets and put it in his bag and not to take it out during the flight when we were going to amsterdam and it was like a 5 min whole big thing and me who was right next to him had pe cricket with some cash attached and the women didn't even take a fraction of a second to double look me and you'd think just to be fair she would have checked both of us to look equaly. imho i say dont go big post 9/11 or you are looking for trouble, including upset passengers who say i don't want him on my plane, look at that 4 inch monster, that could take off my head! again like i said its all about the appearance and actions of that person and the person who checks you in and how they maybe got grilled by a supervisor or had a rough day with the wife or maybe got in trouble last week and want to scrutinize you. it varies, don't take chance and get your permission to board denied. after all not all like knives like we do, would you want someone cutting an apple next to you with a superhawk?

[peacefuljeffrey]

SmoothOne25, are you saying that NOW "you can walk on with a fs police ss bad ass and have them not bat an eyelash"??

I hardly think that's possible, nor has it been since right after 9/11/01--good attitude and wholesome appearance or not!

[Praxis]

Actually, TSA has moved away from knives as a threat to aviation. Two years ago they were actually considering allowing sub-2" knives back onboard planes, since they felt that small knives no longer represented any threat to the aircraft. The flight attendents' union fought it and killed the proposal, because they claimed that small knives still represented a threat to them. So put the blame where it belongs.:o

From what I hear, TSA folks hate searching for knives.* One more distraction from something that might be a real threat.

*Based on direct conversations with TSA headquarters folks

[kbuzbee]

For some reason, 3" is perceived as much less of a threat than 4".

I don't think I agree with that. I view it more as a compromise. They (who ever "they" are ;)) do want to limit size as "they" do view larger knives as more of a threat, generally.

Once you cross that line, you now have to pick an arbitrary limit. Some places it's 3". Some 3 1/2". Whatever. I don't think the thought is 3" is okay and 4" is dangerous. It's more 'if we want to still allow some knives, pick a size that they fall below' (and if I'm being generous, add '...and still allows a functional tool to be carried' but that may be too altruistic)

None of this applies to aircraft today, of course. Their limit is .00001";). I too used to carry something smaller onboard. Never an issue.

My first airport security "incident" was actually not a knife but a screwdriver. It was in the 90s in Tokyo after some cult member tried to hijack a plane by holding a screwdriver to the throat of a flight attendant. I was STUNNED (had no idea this had happened or that my tools were now forbidden). To their credit, they gave my screwdriver to the pilot who had it at the destination customer service desk BEFORE I even got there (Hiroshima IIRC). I was pretty impressed by that.

I wish we could go back to some kind of reasonable carry but those days are long gone, I'm afraid.

Thanks for digging up the old thread. Interesting.

Ken

[JLS]

You make a good point. I was getting at the same thing, but your wording makes it much clearer.

I too would like to go back to the old days. I don't think it'll ever happen, but you never know. I was pretty pessimistic about the possibility of new realistic capacity magazines in the future after the 1994 ban too.

[Bushminer]

Have had issues with 3/16 hex key. As my own plane uses one for the fuel caps I tend to have them littering the scene.

[JNewell]

Anyone reading this thread needs to be really careful to note that most of the first page is pre-9/11. As they say, "That was then, this is now..."

[markg]

Yea, different days...

[peacefuljeffrey]

Better days.
More sensible, less hysterical days... :rolleyes:

[thebestnoobcake]

Flying out from Australia, my sister's nailclippers?? , folding scissors and my leatherman were confiscated a couple of years ago. So I would say.. Just don't carry anything on board.. I'm gonna have to remember to take my SAK off the keychain later this year when I fly to Singapore =[

[whkento]

Yeah, I have to remember to leave my money clip (PE Cricket) at home, too. I don't want that taken away.

[spinynorman]

Reading this thread really surprised me, as I guess I'm not keeping up with what's become acceptable since 9/11. I've flown only once or twice a year since, but thought that the same old rules were in affect, as in not even a nail clipper with a file in it is allowed!! So, I've just packed all my multitools and knives in my checked luggage every time. Also, I keep seeing NTSA confiscated knives and multitools being sold on eBay every time I look. Are there any consistent rules out there, or is it purely the discretion of the particular NTSA person on duty that day? :confused:

Cheers,
Doug

[ControlsGuy]

Take a look at the post dates. This is a very old thread. Shows how much things have changed. It shocked me until I saw the dates.

Still no nail clippers on planes.

[The Deacon]

Take a look at the post dates. This is a very old thread. Shows how much things have changed. It shocked me until I saw the dates.

Still no nail clippers on planes.True, and take any of the newer posts with a grain of salt as well. There MAY be places in the world where airport security is less strict and there MAY be cases where someone makes it through a TSA checkpoint with prohibited items, but counting on either of those could be costly. As has been noted TSA confiscated knives continue to show up on eBay every day. Explaining that "somebody on an internet forum said it would be ok" won't keep them from adding your knife to their swag pile.